Hi,

Norm has it right (I think) that following this rule and being able to
trust that a processor should follow this rule (even when it does not), is
an important stabilizing factor in XSLT development, enabling a very useful
separation of concerns whose boundaries run close to the governance
boundaries (who is actually in control of which data set).

And like David I worry what about when the scoping of variables and
parameters becomes an issue in determining what should be at the end of a
URI, whether it is the same, and whether I should care how many times a
processor makes an attempt on it.

As far as the theory goes, I think Dimitre put his finger on it when he
pointed out the distinction between a closed system and an open one. To
what Norm and Dave have said, I think XSLT has been very well served by
maintaining this "closed universe" fiction. Indeed as Dave P has also
hinted, such a regimen of
data control (in which data that is not controlled, is at least well
understood) is more or less essential to a scalable publishing operation.

This all leads me to think that a non-deterministic fn:refresh-document()
function might be useful in certain circumstances, but that we would be
well advised to leave the plain-vanilla document() function (and its ilk
such as doc() and unparsed-text()) deterministic. They are already a way of
sneaking external state into the transformation. (As such, very useful.
Does my Schematron find my listing in the bibliography feed *today*?) I'd
like to keep it easy to observe those boundaries.

Cheers, Wendell










On Thu, Nov 12, 2020 at 11:39 AM Norm Tovey-Walsh ndw@xxxxxxxxxx <
xsl-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> > I don't expect that anyone wrote XSLT code that relies on these functions
> > being deterministic.
>
> I would be very reluctant to endorse that claim. I have relied on this
> *all the time* in as much as Ibve never given a moment of thought to
> whether or not fn:doc() could possibly return a different answer because
> I know I donbt have to.
>
>                                         Be seeing you,
>                                           norm
>
> --
> Norman Tovey-Walsh <ndw@xxxxxxxxxx>
> https://nwalsh.com/
>
> > Mistakes are a part of being human. Appreciate your mistakes for what
> > they are: precious life lessons that can only be learned the hard way.
> > Unless it's a fatal mistake, which, at least, others can learn
> > from.--Al Franken
>



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